Apex Mountain on The Rewatchables
86:41 – 97:29… don't need to be distracted by. So... Yeah. With that said, I would have gone with a better actor. Have fast internet research. I gave it all to you already. Apex Mountain. The Ed Norton... What was Ed Norton's Apex Mountain is a pretty good question. You could argue it's coming off Red Dragon and then doing this movie, but this movie wasn't that successful. So it's probably Fight Club. I would say it's... Fight Club's a year after American History X. He has the nomination already. This is a good question. Yeah. I mean, I think it's probably Fight Club. It's definitely Fight Club. I think he has the most juice …
The whole segment, as transcribed
I mean, again, this is a movie that wants you to focus on what it wants you to focus on. It doesn't want you getting distracted by a bunch of stuff that you don't need to be distracted by. So... Yeah. With that said, I would have gone with a better actor. Have fast internet research. I gave it all to you already. Apex Mountain. The Ed Norton... What was Ed Norton's Apex Mountain is a pretty good question. You could argue it's coming off Red Dragon and then doing this movie, but this movie wasn't that successful. So it's probably Fight Club. I would say it's... Fight Club's a year after American History X. He has the nomination already. This is a good question. Yeah. I mean, I think it's probably Fight Club. It's definitely Fight Club. I think he has the most juice after Fight Club. Yeah. Because, you know, everything else just seemed like diminished returns in some way. Like he makes that Hulk movie with Ang Lee. Oh, and then it starts. That's not the Ang Lee. No, I'm sorry. I can't believe I just did that. The Eric Bana is the Ang Lee Hulk movie. That is the great... That's a fantastic movie to plug Ang Lee again. He makes the other Hulk movies. Which is the... The in-between Hulk movie. It's a tough one because you can't be the, all I care about is acting, all that stuff, and then do like a sellout role. But he was... I mean, imagine... I don't know. I got to imagine if you're Ed Norton and you know... And there's no question that he is one of the best actors in the movies. And for a while, the most exciting actor in the movies. There is some pressure on you to not... To make good choices. And at some point, like the needs of your ego and the demands of your career, I guess. It just sort of... He got locked into a thing that he couldn't seem to get himself out of. Yeah. That's why he was so great in Birdman, by the way. Because he was... I like him in everything. I'm always excited to see Ed Norton. Yeah, but I mean... Even when he showed up in the Bourne movie, it's like, oh cool, Ed Norton's here. Yeah, but Birdman was him sort of leaning into and embracing an idea of himself that I just thought was... I mean, that was what was so exciting about that performance was like, he was dialed into something that involved an ego. And he got to play that. Why do you think Birdman didn't have kind of the legs? Like, if we did it for the rewatchables, I think people would be surprised. Although they're probably surprised we're doing this one. I mean, your idiosyncrasies do count for something, right? With respect to what's rewatchable. So I think I always think that the test of these movies is whether or not it is. And how rewarding is the experience of rewatching it going to be? I think Birdman, I've seen it since it opened. And it still gives me a kind of pleasure. I have mixed feelings about it, but it's fun to watch. I think it was the most fun to watch the first time. Because you didn't know it was going to happen. It was kind of thrilling. And it was kind of like being on a roller coaster. But now you know where the roller coaster is going. Second time, maybe not the same. But I mean, there was a point when that movie came out where it seemed like the guaranteed Oscar winner. And Keaton was a guaranteed best actor winner. And then, remember, everybody kind of cooled off. It was about three weeks left to go. And it was strange to watch. What happened, though? Something, there was just like a media narrative, I think, that took hold. I don't remember what it was, though. I mean, I'm so far away from that. It was a weird Oscar cool off thing. In it, E2 won. So, I mean, there's that. Apex Mountain, Spike Lee, no. Benioff, no. Hoffman, no. Movies where 9-11 is a character, I would say yes. I think this is the signature 9-11 movie, even though it's not about 9-11. That's a no-brainer. What about Barry Pepper? So, I was going to do this later. Oh, well, let's just save it for later, then. Want to do it now? No, no, let's do it later. Just keep going. Save Barry Pepper. Picking nits. I really only have one. Would being ugly or really help you in prison? It's kind of dubious. My theory on this is that's not what the whole beating was about. I think he wanted to be punished in some way by somebody he knew because he felt so upset that he had let his life get away. So, it was like, yeah. That's a good reading. I just think he wanted to have his friend beat the shit out of him because he was so bad at himself. Would be my take. I think that I'm convinced by that. I'm totally convinced by that. Best quote, champagne for my real friends, real pain for my sham friends. I like that one. I also like- But wait, pause. Yeah. That's just a thing people say. He didn't make that up. No, I just liked hearing it. Oh, okay. The one that is from the movie. I've been in three prisons in three countries, and you know what I learned? Oh. Prison is a bad place to be. It's like, oh, you think so, doctor? Yeah. Could this be remade as a 10-episode Netflix show? Fuck yeah. I mean, I don't want them to do it. Yeah, I don't want them to do it either. This whole concept of somebody's last day would be a really good- Somebody's last day before they go to jail is a good idea for a Netflix show. That would probably actually be a terrible Apple TV show. You'd have to fill it out. It's like, we have a Helmsworth brother. It's his last day. It's the 25th hour. Next on Apple TV. You can get all three Helmsworth brothers in a remake of this movie. Yeah, they beat up one of them. You can get all three. Yeah. Yeah. Probably unanswerable questions. Yeah. Is this movie better if Matt Damon is in the Barry Pepper part? Oh, S-H-I-T. I asked this for two reasons. One, would he do a better job? Two, is that a really fun Matt Damon role that he hasn't really played the movie? And then three, bonus point, does this movie have a better chance to be recognized for an Oscar if it's Ed Norton, Matt Damon, Philip Seymour Hoffman, and Spike Lee, and then you have the fourth piece of just the Rounders reunion. And I say this really liking Barry Pepper in this movie. But if it's Damon, where do we, I feel like the ceiling gets higher. Well, this is again, I mean, even without you asking this excellent question, I had already felt like what I wanted was more time with each man on his own, right? And I think that you put Matt Damon in the part and it sort of changes things. I think Barry Pepper became a better actor as the decade went on. I think if you put Matt Damon in this part, it does kind of, it makes it less, it just changes the stakes a little bit and you don't exactly know. It would require you to flesh out that character more than he is already. It's probably a longer movie, but I think it's taken more seriously as an awards movie because of the names involved at that point. I wonder. I mean, it's interesting. Like, how do you, I mean, I wonder what Barry Pepper would say, how people would, how people would say they feel about Barry Pepper. Like, Well, I can tell you how I feel. I really liked him in Saving Private Ryan. I thought he was good in Enemy of the State. I thought he was excellent in 61, which is one of my favorite TV movies. He's Roger Maris. Didn't he win an Emmy for that? He might have. I think he was either nominated or he won. I really liked him in Knock Around Guys. I thought he was good in that. I really liked him in 25th Hour. All of those movies take place from 98 to 02. And then the wheels kind of came off, but there was a moment there where it's like, 61 was before, was before this? Yeah, 61 was 2001. Oh, wow. So that's why I think his Apex Mountain was probably 61. Yeah. Because you come out of that and you think like, oh, that guy's a leading actor. He'll be in the discussion. And it just never happened. I, I think he might have been a little eccentric. He, I mean, he, my evidence is he played Johnny Goodboy Taylor, Johnny Goodboy Tyler in Battlefield Earth. That's right. It's him in Travolta in Battlefield Earth. I, without casping too many aspersions on Scientology, like he's in Battlefield Earth. That's a red flag. But that was, but that was during this run that he had. I know. This was 99 or 2000 or whatever, right? I think he might've been a little, I don't know. It's a good actor though. And he's great in this movie, but is the upset higher with Damon? I don't know. Any other unanswerable questions? Does, well, I mean, this is sort of an extra narrative question, but like what's Philip Seymour Hoffman's character's Monday like? I mean. Awkward. Probably handing in his resignation. Yeah. I mean, I just wonder. Hey, stay away from your 17 year old students with elaborate belly button, tattoo, hearing stuff. That's one of the many lessons of this movie. Don't let him into the club. What happens when Norton gets out of prison seven years later? Is Rosara Dawson waiting for her? I'm going to say no. I think she's long gone. And the dad's probably dead. I don't think, yeah, I don't know. What is her job in this movie, by the way? Do we know? Does she have a career? Or is she just a girlfriend? It's unclear. I can't remember. I always assumed she was like a waitress or something. Cause the fight, the fight between her character and Barry Pepper's character is about like the choices, the, you know, the looking, all the looking the other way that she did as his girlfriend and how she's complicit in his, in his, in his drug dealing life. Maybe she was a student. Maybe. Yeah. Yeah. Because she was, he does say that she was 17. She was, she was Anna Paquin's age when they met. So. Right. Whatever, whatever that is. Who won the movie for you? This is a complicated one. Could go in a couple directions. Yeah. Um, but I'm, I'm an adult and I've, well, I have three answers to that question. Number three, Rodrigo Prieto. Just a beautiful movie. It is just a beautiful, beautiful movie. The shot. I feel like you've come, you've come all the way around. I feel great about this. This is now one of your favorite Spike Lee movies. This is awesome. I've done, I've done God's work. Um, uh,
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